Shinya Aoki Shut Out Against Gilbert Melendez
It isn't very often, especially within the confines of one division, where the consensus number one and number two get dissected by opponents that many believed would be easy wins for them. Yet in the realm of the Lightweight division this is exactly what happened; first BJ Penn's loss to Frankie Edgar last week and now tonight Shinya Aoki lost to a very game Gilbert Melendez.
The hype for the fight was if Aoki wins, many would consider him the number one lightweight in the world and that his ground skills would be too much for Melendez. Aoki, of course, went as far as to say that if he lost, Japanese MMA would find itself in a very dark place. In the grand scheme of things, Shinya Aoki losing in a very decisive manner does throw a wrench into the works, but is hardly a death rattle for DREAM or Japanese MMA as a whole.
Aoki is never known as a stand up fighter, and against fighters with superior stand up he has shown quite a bit of weakness. The big differences between Aoki's fights in Japan and his fight in Strikeforce were the cage and his inability to wear grappling pants. Aoki scoffed and brushed off the questions that came from American reporters who questioned if he'd have a hard time getting traction without his grappling pants, but the few times where he was able to get a hold of Melendez and was working the rubber guard it was more difficult for him to hold on or really do anything of note from the position. The other crux which he wasn't able to overcome was the cage, Melendez was able while on the ground to push Aoki up against the cage and thusly block any sort of offense he could have from the bottom position.
If the fight happened in Japan there is no doubt it would've been a different fight without a cage and with the different rules. Of course this pokes a lot of holes in how people rank MMA, especially in the lightweight division, as this shows just how hard it is to compare American MMA and Japanese MMA. The fact that Aoki did not win a single round is almost irrelevant to his fighting style as Shinya Aoki has never been a truly dominant fighter as opposed to a fighter that can fight himself out of bad positions and pull off impressive wins. Aoki has no stand up to speak of and went into this fight with grappling alone at his disposal.
I know for many the talk of a rematch will die down as it wouldn't seem competitive, but a rematch under DREAM rules in a ring could be an entirely different fight and one I'd like to see.
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It seems like several of the Japanese fighters have had trouble when they come to fight over here. Do you think it’s simply cage vs. ring, or is the quality of the competition actually that different? Or perhaps different training styles, or different rules to deal with? It just seems like so many of the fighters that are considered really good in DREAM or Sengoku just can’t cut it in the US: Gomi, Gono, and now Aoki, just to name a few.
Or am I guilty of having too narrow a viewpoint?
"We don't need no water, let the Badr Hari burn!" - Michael Schiavello
Well, Gomi was shot
Any hope anybody had for him was based on like 2005 Gomi, which he just isn’t anymore.
I think most of the issues guys have is weight-cutting. American MMA is intertwined with the whole wrestling concept of cut down to wherever you can get. Melendez was clearly bigger than Aoki in this fight, but then again it is doubtful that Aoki could cut to 145, either. Was Gono ever considered that good? His only impressive win in the past few years was that armbar over Mousasi.
I think we’ve seen a lot of guys transition from Japan to the US and just be small, like Cro Cop. That dude should be fighting at 205 without a doubt.
With Aoki I think a lot of it had to do with him having no striking, obviously, and then the no pants and not knowing how to react to the cage. The cage really cut him off from doing what he does and without his magical pants he had no way to get a grip on himself after things got sweaty. You’ll notice in the first when he got a hold of Gil he was able to continue to hold him, but anything after that he couldn’t keep a grasp.
Head Kick Legend
Twitter @HeadKickLegend
I guess I might be confusing ‘good’ with ‘popular’, at least with Gono lol… the first time I saw him fight was in the UFC, and though I know I watched it, I don’t remember him at all (I think that was the Leben/Bisping card). But he seems to be huge in Japan, which is why (to my understanding) SRC screwed Hornbuckle out of his fight at New Years – he took Gono’s head off, and upset a lot of ppl when they saw their star carried out of the ring on a stretcher.
I totally agree with you on Aoki being lost in there. Which brings up another point, don’t these guys train in the cage before their fights? Surely they do, right?
"We don't need no water, let the Badr Hari burn!" - Michael Schiavello
by Jackie Maden on Apr 18, 2010 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions
If the stupid ref would have just let aoki but scoot it would have been a different fight. Melendez was taking the bait every time and the reb stands them up. It would be a different fight in DREAM.
Twitter @i_c_u_hater
by Thats It For you! on Apr 18, 2010 1:04 PM EDT reply actions
Oh, yeah, there were terrible standups in this fight
I was talking to a few of the BE guys about this last night and it was hilarious. I was actually downright shocked when he stood them up once where Aoki was just throwing his leg over the shoulder of Melendez into a possible Triangle position. I’m shocked that nobody else is talking about that, never mind the crab walk is an offensive move and shouldn’t be stood up.
It is different than the Leites lay on your back and wait.
Head Kick Legend
Twitter @HeadKickLegend
Those standups were attrocious
There was one late in the fight — 4th round, maybe? — where Gil was stood up right after landing a sick diving punch. That could’ve been a TKO, but he was warned for it instead. Ridonkulous.
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Really? "If the fight happened in Japan there is no doubt it would've been a different fight"
Stop making excuses for Aoki. He himself already said he felt comfortable in the cage and that Gilbert was just better than him.
PPL forget quickly Aoki’s other losses to Sakurai and Hansen pretty quickly. With the right gameplan, Aoki can be beat. That’s exactly what Malendez did.
Aoki has ZERO standup when compared to other top lightweights. He’s a grappler, not a fighter (yet).
On a side note, no respect for Melendez. He initiated the post-fight brawl and acted like a little thug. Cesar Grace camp should be ashamed. But what do you expect from these idiots that are in Stockton.
I never said by different it would mean Aoki would win, did I?
All I’m saying is he’d have his magical anti-slip pants on and would have no cage to be pushed up against.
Head Kick Legend
Twitter @HeadKickLegend
Tell
all the fighters he beat that they lost against a not yet fighter.
Come on. He just lost an unanimous decision to a great champion. Nothing to be ashamed.
Also Aoki
took a lot of good shots from Melendez, and he kept trying to get the fight to the ground. He at least proved to have a decent chin.
Twitter @i_c_u_hater
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by Thats It For you! on Apr 19, 2010 9:33 AM EDT reply actions

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